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Zybo-Z7 and Vivado 2019.2 (+ Vitis + Petalinux)


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Hi

sorry in advance for a question that I maybe should be able to answer by myself using Google. I really did but still I don't know. The reason therefore probably is that I'm just about to get in touch with Petalinux and Zynqs PS at all. I never did before.

So, do I understand correctly that with a Zybo Z7-20 it doesn't make sense to update to Vivado 2019.2? The most recent version of Petalinux for exactly this board is 2017.4. Software on this shouldn't or cannot be developed by using Vitis instead of SDK. Is this correct?

Vivado 2019.2 and  SDK are totally incompatible, this I know by now (I think ;) ). Unfortunately I already upgraded to Vivado 2019.2, using PL only yet anyway, and was even quite happy about recent bugfixes (with Archlinux).

So,

  1. Is it impossible to use Petalinux 2019.2 on Zybo Z7-20 or what are the limitations/difficulties? Are there no board components usable at all without the right BSP?
  2. Is it impossible to use Vitis 2019.2 on Petalinux 2017.4 or what are the limitations/difficulties?
  3. Is it already known when in Q1 2020 this announced Petalinux-upgrade for Zybo Z7 could be expected?

Thank you!

 

/edit

Release in Q1 2020 could be in 2 weeks :)

On 9/10/2019 at 11:12 AM, Ionel said:

The BSP for zybo-z7-20 will work properly only with petalinux 2017.4. Upgrade for the BSP is estimated to take place after petalinux 2019.2 is released Q1 next year.

 

Edited by yottabyte
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1. Petalinux 2019.2 could be used with Zybo Z7-20 once we upgrade the project. Updating the project from 2017.4 is complex and not really feasible to be done by anyone else other than us in order to support all interfaces on the board.

2. Projects are incompatible with other versions than the one it was created with.

3. This is more of a Xilinx question but it appears they have moved to two releases per year: at the end of Q2 and Q4.

Please have a look at Xilinx's documentation regarding Vitis and Petalinux.

https://www.xilinx.com/html_docs/xilinx2019_2/vitis_doc/Chunk1927950541.html

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Thank you for answering!

1 hour ago, vicentiu said:

3. This is more of a Xilinx question but it appears they have moved to two releases per year: at the end of Q2 and Q4.

Isn't the Petalinux support be done by Digilent -as you also say in 1.? But I noticed in the Xilinx doc you showed me that there is no BSP anymore in the new VITIS developewment flow. The Vitis Platform Project would contain Zybo-specific information about onboard components, right and is needed for any kind of developement, right? So does Xilinx publicize Platform Projects (if you say it's a X. question)?

If don't want to wait for a couple of months, I have to install 2017.4 toolchain, right?

Or is it worth it installing Petalinux 2019.2 (and Vitis) on a Zynq Z7-20 already?

 

Something that just shocked me a little: Are there really something between 32 and 64GB of RAM needed to run VITIS? Oh man, the 16 I have are already Laptops maximum.......

 

Edited by yottabyte
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3 hours ago, yottabyte said:

Something that just shocked me a little: Are there really something between 32 and 64GB of RAM needed to run VITIS?

I apologize in advance for being in one of my philosophical moods.... but...

Not sure where the large memory requirements came from but they ring true.

With Vivado 2019.2 developers have to start changing the way that they do business. With the latest release we have to decide if it makes sense to upgrade or hold on to past tools for a while. Vivado 2019.2 not only can't understand it's own IP from previous versions it has jettisoned tried and true software development tools in favor of a new paradigm. We can't just install the latest without doing some serious homework and Xilinx isn't going to make that chore easy. Petalinux development required a Linux host. How does Vitas change that? I still don't know. What platforms are supported by Vitas? It depends on what piece of documentation you happen to be reading.

If you are keeping up with the next bit new thing from Xilinx and Intel you know that the new battleground isn't in the embedded space anymore; it in high-end computer co-processing. Intel has a lead because they make the FPGAs and the computer processors. The little guy has already been left behind by Intel as far as FPGA development goes. I'm hoping that Xilinx won't turn it's back on us with VItas; but encouraging caution is certainly not a stupid idea.

This is where community forums are important. I'd certainly like to hear about experiences, good or bad,  from anyone who's surfing the bleeding edge. In days or yore we had FAEs from vendors or distributors to help guide us past the hidden land mines. If you company isn;t a platinum customer those days are gone.

Edited by zygot
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On 12/17/2019 at 10:40 AM, vicentiu said:

We haven't had a chance to work with Vitis and 2019.2 yet. We support Petalinux for our boards and for Zybo Z7-20 that currently includes 2017.4.

You need to install 2017.4 for Zybo Z7-20 for now.

Any update on the 2019.2 BSP package?

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Hello,

I also would like to try Vitis on the Zybo Z7-20, I understand it is impossible without a new PetaLinux release from Digilent ?

The author of this article (in japanese, I read it through a translator) seems to make it work, creating its own PetaLinux (with XRT). @vicentiu, could you elaborate on what could be missing in its custom-made PetaLinux ?  

Edited by mpick
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Theoretically, you can do everything in bare metal that you can do in Linux.

Practically, if there are libraries already implemented in Linux, reimplementing it in bare metal could be years worth of effort.

Xilinx has some DPU resources but I don't know if they are for bare metal or Petalinux.

I suggest looking at Xilinx's DPU resources to see if they are intended for bare metal or Petalinux.

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38 minutes ago, vicentiu said:

If you need Petaliux on the board, you are correct that you'd need a 2019.2 version of Petalinux

I've spent some time since my first post trying to figure out what's in store for users with Vitis.

With Vivado 2019.2 + Vitis you still need a Linux host to develop Petalinux applications. It was a chore, but I did manage to install Petalinux 2019.1 onto a Ubuntu 18.04 VM running in HyperV on my Win10 Pro box. This PC has 32 GB ram so I can allocate 8 GB to the VM. I haven't as yet actually created a project with the Petalinux tool this way yet. My plan is to wait and see how well Xilinx develops the tools with the next release before moving to 2019.2 and the new paradigm. Note that Vivado 2019.2 also breaks even Xilinx IP created in previous versions. For now I'm sticking with VIvado 2019.1 and Petalinux 2019.1.

In 2019.2 tools Vivado and Vitis are not integrated. You still have to export hardware but you can't launch Vitis from Vivado. I'm assuming that at some point in the future users will start off in Vitis and launch Vivado from within that IDE.

** It's been my experience that overall performance with Linux VMs in WIn10 is poor unless you start with one of the 'optimized' quick start images from Msoft. Unfortunately, there is no way to change the default disk size of 12 GB, which is way too small do doing anything useful... like even install Petalinux. You can resize the VM disk size after creating the VM but you still need to install a disk management tool like Gparted onto your VM to re-size the Unbuntu partition to make use of the expanded disk size. Needless to say all of this should be done before completely setting up and updating the VM. The whole process of installing Petalinux was rather messy and time consuming.

And HyperV is... well Msoft, so get used to frustration, pain and misery.

Edited by zygot
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13 minutes ago, vicentiu said:

I suggest looking at Xilinx's DPU resources to see if they are intended for bare metal or Petalinux.

Thanks !

Xilinx documentation and tutorials all rely on PetaLinux. This answer from the Xilinx forum confirms the need of an OS to use a DPU.

@zygot, I already develop on a powerful Linux machine and I am willing to collaborate in Vitis exploration...

Edited by mpick
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32 minutes ago, zygot said:

In 2019.2 tools Vivado and Vitis are not integrated. You still have to export hardware but you can't launch Vitis from Vivado. I'm assuming that at some point in the future users will start off in Vitis and launch Vivado from within that IDE.

On my 2019.2 Ubuntu install, I still have "Launch Vitis" from the "Tools" menu in Vivado.

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20 minutes ago, mpick said:

On my 2019.2 Ubuntu install, I still have "Launch Vitis" from the "Tools" menu in Vivado

Yes, you are correct. It's the same on my Windows installation... just didn't find it before.

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It is still the case that while Vitis happily installs itself and Vivado on Windows platforms and replaces most of the former software development tools, Linux and Petalinux are not among those supported on Windows. I guess, that in theory, the Linux subsystem in WIn10 could be leveraged to provide a completely integrated HW/SW development environment; but this is not the situation WIN10 users find themselves in as of today.

Edited by zygot
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Should we be able to use 2019.2 and current hardware files for the Zybo and get a FreeRTOS based program to run?  I'm having trouble getting it to load.

Error while launching program: 
Memory write error at 0x10D000. MMU section translation fault


 

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On 1/28/2020 at 10:37 AM, mpick said:

On my 2019.2 Ubuntu install, I still have "Launch Vitis" from the "Tools" menu in Vivado.

I saw that as well, but the Vitis doesn't have any hardware link for the Genesys ZU board I have. 

Does Digilent have resources for that, and if so where is that located and what is the process to include that?

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Hi @Steven Cornett,

I apologize for the long delay since I evidently never hit the submit reply button.

I think there is some confusion between a hardware platform and a board file. The board files are available on Digilent's GitHub here, https://github.com/Digilent/vivado-boards, and provide Vivado with context about what materials exist on the board and provide configurations for some parts, such as the Zynq chip.

The hardware platform which Vitis uses will need to be generated and exported from Vivado. From my understanding, Digilent has not made any pre-built .xsa files for the Genesys ZU to use. This Getting Started with Vivado IPI for 2019.2 that we have will walk you through the process of creating and exporting such a file.

Thanks,
JColvin

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I figured out about the need to give VItis my Vivado .xsa project file after throwing it over the wall after I wrote this.  My, this setup is a bit of a learning curve, but as the philosophers of old said, that which we need to do we learn by doing.

I'll definitely take a look at the new guide.  

Thank you very much.

“For the things we have to learn before we can do them, we learn by doing them.”  - Aristotle

 

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